**Matti Pitkanen** (*matpitka@pcu.helsinki.fi*)

*Sun, 19 Sep 1999 08:44:52 +0300 (EET DST)*

**Messages sorted by:**[ date ] [ thread ] [ subject ] [ author ]**Next message:**WDEshleman@aol.com: "[time 791] Re: [time 788] Noumenon and Phenomenon"**Previous message:**Stephen P. King: "[time 789] Re: [time 787] Event-Horizons & Mind-Body"**In reply to:**WDEshleman@aol.com: "[time 787] Event-Horizons & Mind-Body"

On Sat, 18 Sep 1999 WDEshleman@aol.com wrote:

*> In a message dated 9/17/99 12:19:42 AM Eastern Daylight Time,
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*> matpitka@pcu.helsinki.fi writes:
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*>
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*> > > [MP]
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*> > > Precisely. Universe is the highest self in the hierarchy of selves
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*> > > and is continually awake since it cannot entangle with anything larger
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*> > > and thus lose its consciousness.
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*> > >
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*> > > [WDE]
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*> > > It is only a look[HK]. The reasoning that leads to the relativistic
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*> > > prediction of the phenomenon of an event horizon surrounding a
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*> > > black-hole at R = 2 * G * M / c^2, also leads to a relativistic event-
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*> > > horizon surrounding a universe.
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*> >
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*> [MP]
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*> > I think that your argument about horizon does not bite in case of TGD.
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*> > The concept of event horizon belongs to the realm of geometric spacetime.
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*> > I am speaking about universe as quantum history: superposition
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*> > of spacetime surfaces. It does not matter whether spacetime surfaces
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*> > have event horizons since the concept of universe as self is
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*> > purely Hilbert-space level concept.
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*>
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*> [WDE]
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*> I know that you imagine everything wrapped in TGD surfaces. I too see
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*> a wrapping, but by event-horizons. The wrapping for our bodies and brains
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*> etc., I suggest, is at the level of our atoms and molecules. The geometric
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*> spacetime has the concept of event-horizon, I admit that it is likely to be a
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*> purely relativistic phenomenon. What happens if you wrap a TGD surface
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*> around a spherical mass (M) of radius (R), such that R = GM/c^2 ?
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*>
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I hope I am answering to your question.

a) Event horizon R=2GM (hbar=c=1) General Relativistic phenomenon

Also in TGD also event horizons appear (trivially). One can imbed

Schwartchild metric as 4-surface and finds that it is imbedddable dow to a

radius which is something like 10^-14 times Schwartschild radius 2GM.

Therefore black holes emerge also in TGD

If I had chosen CP_2 radius to be order Planck length, I would have

practically lost blackholes, the imbeddability of Schwarschild metric

would have failed at distance of order event horizon and this would

have killed TGD.

b) Besides event horizons there are elementary particle horizons.

These are 3-surfaces at which the spacetime metric changes from

Minkowskian signature to Euclidian signature. All wormhole throats

connecting spacetime sheets to larger spacetime sheets are surrounded

by this kind of horizons. At horizon determinant of

the induced metric vanishes. This means classically that there is

not any strong interaction between interior degrees of freedom

of various spacetime sheets: they feel only gravitational force

and electric forces affecting center of mass motion.

This in turn leads to to the idea that different

spacetime sheets behave like selves and do not generate much entanglement

with other sheets. One could say that selves are quantum counterparts

of blackholes/objects surrounded by elementary particle horizon.

In any case, when I speak about universe I mean quantum history and

entire infinite spacetime surface, which by definition cannot be

surrounded by event horizon since there is no larger 3-surface

present!

Best,

MP

**Next message:**WDEshleman@aol.com: "[time 791] Re: [time 788] Noumenon and Phenomenon"**Previous message:**Stephen P. King: "[time 789] Re: [time 787] Event-Horizons & Mind-Body"**In reply to:**WDEshleman@aol.com: "[time 787] Event-Horizons & Mind-Body"

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